Grow a pair, Australia

I’m fed up with all the misinformation going around in Australia about the carbon tax. Here’s a few short points you need to know about carbon reduction in Australia.

  • Australia is not ‘going it alone’ by pricing carbon. That’s bullshit, plain and simple.
  • Both parties plan to put a price on carbon. Labor’s price on carbon is a $23/tonne direct price, the indirect price from the Coalition’s direct action scheme is an estimated $15/tonne.
  • Labour’s plan will see this price paid by the industries who create the carbon pollution. The Coalition’s plan doesn’t charge the polluters – the taxpayer foots the bill.
  • The estimated costs to everyday Australians under Labour’s carbon tax are based on averages. You, personally, have some control over the cost. By consuming less power, or buying less carbon-intensive products, you will dodge most of the tax. However, you will still get the benefit of tax cuts. So if you’re smart, you can come out ahead under Labour’s scheme. Under the Coalition’s scheme, you will pay no matter what.
  • Black Friday bushfires. Great Barrier Reef bleaching. Queensland floods. 2010 the hottest year on record. Wake up and realise this problem is real, it is happening now, and it will get much worse if we do nothing.

There you go. I’m not a cheerleader for the Gillard Labour government – I don’t think the scheme gets us where we need to be. A 5% cut by 2020 is nowhere near enough. The environment doesn’t care what’s politically or economically feasible, it cares how many billions of tons of carbon dioxide are pumped into the atmosphere. But Labour’s policy is better than the Coalition’s, for the taxpayer (i.e., you and me) and for the future.

Don’t be a bunch of selfish pricks, Australia. Grow a pair and shell out a few dollars a week to help protect your future and your grandkids’ future – not to mention the billions of other people, plants and animals around the world who will suffer under climate change.

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Categories: communication, Politics, Problems | Tags: , , , , , , , , | 14 Comments

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14 thoughts on “Grow a pair, Australia

  1. M@

    Dugg for best title ever.

  2. Couldn’t have put it better myself!

  3. John

    “By consuming less power, or buying less carbon-intensive products, you will dodge most of the tax.” << That is laughable.
    I use less power, and my bills go up. How am I to use less power than I currently am? Should I start turning my fridge off?
    I use less water, and my bills go up. I used $33 worth of water and yet my water bill is $180 due to all the extra charges. Its all gone up to cover the desalination plant.
    Guess what, desalination plant is going to use power to run, which will have carbon tax applied to it. So water will go up, again!
    The only way I will ever support a carbon tax if if we finally build some Nuclear power plants.

    • Patrick

      The fact that your power bill is currently going up has little to do with pricing carbon, so really is irrelevant to the proposition advanced in the article, which really just amounts to a suggestion that the fixed cost imposed by the coalitions plan can’t be avoided whilst the behavioural related cost imposed by labor could be. Obviously under the carbon tax you as a consumer you will be faced with a decision of how much you value running electrical items such as fridges. However, if you (as a rational human being) believe that benefit of running your fridge outweighs the extra cost you face (assuming that that the rebate doesn’t cover it) then you will remain economically better off to run the fridge. However, the brilliance of the plan is that somebody will not value running certain electrical products and will stop using them. That is letting the market allocate resources effectively – in this case carbon. Any price increase due to the carbon tax actually just brings the cost of electricity (or water or any other good of this type) up to the real price which takes into account all of the costs which have up to now been externalised.

      No citizen has a right to expect something for free.

      • Thanks Pat, you eloquently said exactly what I’d have liked to! It comes down to this: supplying water isn’t free. Supplying power isn’t free. The carbon tax builds, to a small extent, one of the (usually) external costs of energy use (ie the economic, social and environmental cost of climate change) into the price.

  4. Yeah, and nuke plants take about a decade to get running, not to mention their short-comings..
    Things will go up – that’s the point. What did you expect to happen; you’d continue to use as much or less energy as you did five years ago and the per-watt rate likewise stayed the same?
    Nuke power isn’t keep, nor does it help with our business-a-usual addiction to cheap, finite energy.
    Carbon taxing is only a small part of where we should be heading and is useless if seen otherwise. Take for instance your power usage. No, you shouldn’t need to turn it off, but ever more efficient models will be the demand by the consumer. You can’t cry out about rising power costs, on the back of 60yrs of a neo-liberal growth economic experiment because the tech available, the housing design and urban sprawl are as inefficient as they ever could be.
    We need to do things differently and as we seem obsessed with protecting this version of the economy, we need to grab it by the reins and shift it to something slightly more sustainable.
    My power prices are going up too and so far I’ve done less that I would’ve liked to in reducing my energy use. That said, I’m not willing in the coming couple of years to by a smart grid / solar set-up. But over 2012, I will start to build the set-up required to get most of my energy requirements off-grid.
    It’s possible and as much as the first few decades of the 2000’s will be (and have been) uncomfortable, you won’t hear me complaining about the price of things, but sticking it up at consumerism and making how I live more comfortable and cheap than most.

  5. rogerthesurf

    Personally I believe that you Australians will be crazy to let your government get away with this excuse for raising taxation.

    Here is what I said in a previous comment which may be relevant.

    “Someone said “I support a carbon tax in which the 500 biggest polluters in Australia have to pay for the cost of their pollution, reflecting their impact on our environment.””

    And my answer was

    “Let me give you a brief lesson on basic economics:-

    Whether or not you think that the life giving gas CO2 is a pollutant, please be assured that the 500 biggest polluters in Australia will never actually pay a cent of tax, carbon or otherwise.
    You seem to forget that these 500 companies supply goods and services in some way to you. In otherwords, although it may be vicariously through a train of manufacture – wholesaler/distributor and retail ultimately the end user, thats you and me pay the taxation for these companies in the price we pay for their services. Especially when it is an across the board tax like this one.
    For instance, you may notice the price of fuel and food going up. That will be you paying the carbon tax. Even if you are elligible for the tax break threshold the government will need to make up that tax somewhere else, and probably create a new government department to deal with it. Where will they get this tax from? Well lets think? Print money? Well I can assure you they wont do too much of that, because inflation is not a good idea. Well they will tax rich people and companies probably owned by those rich people more. So who will pay for that? Yup you guessed it. You and I.
    Isn’t that just crap?

    Australians should run around after that funny lady and wave banners saying “tax us please, we love tax, we will always vote for you if you tax us more etc””

    Did you hear anyone describe how the tax will effect CO2 emissions (as if they are a problem)? Nope because the tax will do nothing, just another excuse to waste everyones money.
    I my country we have an ETS. The leader of the opposition is already talking about how he will spend the proceeds of it. http://crasspoliticsnz.files.wordpress.com/2011/06/philgoff-and-ets.pdf

    BTW in case you don’t know it, cash from an ETS system is supposed to be spent on planting trees and buying carbon credits etc. The government supposedly should have no claim to the proceeds.”

    “Don’t be a bunch of selfish pricks, Australia. Grow a pair and shell out a few dollars a week to help protect your future and your grandkids’ future “

    If you think “saving” the world is going to only cost you a few dollars a week, well you better get that out of your mind right away. because whoever gave you that idea was duping you in the biggest way possible.

    The truth is that if and when your government screws things down in order to attain the 60% decrease in CO2 emissions as demanded by the IPCC there will be a cataclysmic economic collapse! This means just a little more than pocket money.
    If you can imagine for instance what will happen if fossil fuels are prohibited to get the decrease you might be able to imagine what I mean. 10% would be bad enough! Its because fossil fuels have an inelastic price/demand if you will excuse the economic jargon.

    Worse still, there is still no scientific proof for the unproven “Anthropogenic CO2 causes Global Warming” hypothesis and in fact there are plenty of disproving factors, so the whole thing is absolutely crazy anyway.

    Cheers
    Roger

    http://www.rogerfromnewzealand.wordpress.com

    PS
    David,

    I see from my records that we have had words before. Well with your superior knowledge and understanding, I would expect you to have some well structured and supported answers for my comment

    • “please be assured that the 500 biggest polluters in Australia will never actually pay a cent of tax, carbon or otherwise.”

      Gee, you must know something that the huge, carbon-intensive industries lobbying against this tax don’t. I’ll bet they’d stop protesting if they realised they won’t ever pay a cent of any tax, ever.

      “Did you hear anyone describe how the tax will effect CO2 emissions (as if they are a problem)?”

      Are you serious? Do you do any background reading on these things before you write about them? Yes. I did hear multiple people describe this, starting with the Prime Minister who announced the details of the scheme.

      “The truth is that if and when your government screws things down in order to attain the 60% decrease in CO2 emissions as demanded by the IPCC there will be a cataclysmic economic collapse!”

      Citation needed.

      As usual Roger, you show a completely warped view of reality. I’ll thank you to save it for your own blog – you’ve previously shown on here that you are completely unwilling to engage in useful discussion or debate.

      • rogerthesurf

        ““please be assured that the 500 biggest polluters in Australia will never actually pay a cent of tax, carbon or otherwise.”

        Gee, you must know something that the huge, carbon-intensive industries lobbying against this tax don’t. I’ll bet they’d stop protesting if they realised they won’t ever pay a cent of any tax, ever.”

        They simply recover the tax from their customers and ultimately that is you and me.

        “The truth is that if and when your government screws things down in order to attain the 60% decrease in CO2 emissions as demanded by the IPCC there will be a cataclysmic economic collapse!”

        I can give you the full explanation if you are prepared to publish it.

        If you simply trust your politicians, especially that funny communist lady you call Prime Minister you are simply naive.

        Cheers

        Roger

        http://www.rogerfromnewzealand.wordpress.com

        • *waves* Bye! Be sure to publish your detailed explanation of how reducing emissions will cause catastrophic economic collapse… on your own blog!

  6. Wow, you haven’t yet block the troll known as roger – who clearly knows something that the world’s leading climate scientists and economists don’t, all wrapped up in the most outdated climate denial memes still doing the rounds.

    If you think AGW is a myth, good on you. If you think we’ve nothing to fear with growing energy security, good on you. If you think ocean acidification shouldn’t concern us, I give you a round of applause. If you think air quality on it’s own right isn’t a reason to clean up our act, I ask you to propose this to the Victorian EPA and many of the locals from the Gippsland. If you think cashing in what is free sources of constant energy is harmful for the economy and prosperity, I wish you well.

    Whatever you say, Roger, I’m happy for you to say it – there are worse people that you out there with more despicable ideologies that they try to impose on others than you’re simply fear of the changing world, new tech and a shift away from the old-world view of the brave white male running the industrial world.

    That said, I have no interest in hearing it or reading it. You’re concerned about your pocket and you personal sense of place in the world. I, on the other hand, look at my son and am actively involved in the research and keep up to date with other fields of environmental science and simply cannot tolerate where we’re heading.

    Sorry Dave, I’m going to stop following this stream. Roger disgusts me.

    • Yeah, I have only replied to let him know I’m not going to tolerate any more from him on this thread, because otherwise he’ll keep trying and clog up my queue. There have been entertaining moments from ol’ Roge though, like when he said I don’t understand how science works.

  7. Pingback: Abbott’s Smells a Dud – Check Yourself, Mate. « New Anthropocene

  8. Pingback: Grow a pair, Australia « New Anthropocene

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